हरि पौडेल जी को प्रश्न लक्ष्मी तामाङ्ग जी को उतर: जातीय वर्गीकरण र धर्म

आज विहानै मेरो फेसबुक ईनबक्समा हरि पौडेल ज्युले निम्न अनुसारको प्रश्न गर्नु भएको रहेछन र मैले उनको प्रतिउतर फेसबुकमा खुल्ला रुपमा उत्तर दिंदा उपयुक्त ठानेर सोहि अनुसार दिए किन कि सबैको मनमा जिज्ञासा त्यस्तो हुन् सक्छ मेरो आफ्नो लेख प्रति जुन म सत्य, तथ्य र यथार्थको आधारमा लेख्ने गर्छु मानवताको लागि अनि प्राय भ्रमबादमा जिउदै आएकाहरुलाई अपच्य हुन् पनि सक्छ अज्ञानताले गर्दा |

हरि जिको प्रश्न:

Laxmi Tamang ji...

K all Janajati lae jasari eutae suchi ma rakera aakada thulo dekhi..testae garera all hindu ko aakada rakda k hola? k all Janajati ko rahansahan...problem..eutae xa....Janajati madhme ma pani Tamang ko culture....rai ko culture....Magar ko culture etc ma kati difference hola?

Yadi tesari Bahun Chhetri lae ek thuma rakne vaye..terai ka Bahun n Chhetri pani tehi aakadama sametinu parenara...terai ma pani ta Bahun Chhetri considerable amount mai xaan ni hoenara?

Ajhae religion wise jane ho vane ta dali...madhesi ta derae jaso sayaad hindu holan....Magar ...Newar pani ta Hindu nae hun? kasto unclear type ko presentation...Janajati ma pani culture religion etc different vayeka ko kati xaan 6utaunu paroni pahila...hoenara?

shaybha ra sista bhasa ma mero jigyasa metaedinu vayo vane ma tapae parti aabhari hune thiye....?

मेरा प्यारा मित्र हरि जी तपाईको प्रश्नको लागि धेरै धेरै धन्यबाद सत्य, तथ्य र यथार्थ बुझ्न चाहनु भएकोमा |

सर्व प्रथम तपाईले बुझ्नु पर्ने मैले जे जति प्रमाण, जानकारी र तथ्यांक, आदि सेर गर्छु त्यो मैले मनगंते रुपमा निर्माण गरेको, तयार पारेको वा उत्पादन गरेको होइन | त्यो त हाम्रै देशका विद्वान बुद्धिजीवी अधिकारिक व्यक्तित्वहरुले नेपाल सरकारको लागि तयार परि दिनु भएको हो मैले मात्र अध्धयन गरेर जानकारीको लागि सेर गरेको हु | त्यसैले तपाईको आवाज त्यस्तो आधिकारिक व्यक्तित्वहरुसंग पुगोस भनेर मैले तपाईको जिज्ञासा र सुझाव यहाँ पुब्लिक स्पेसमा सेर गरेको छु | आसा छ तपाईको आफ्नो धारणा बारेमा उनीहरुले मनन गर्ने छन् मानवताको लागि |

अर्को कुरा तपाई ले बुझ्नु पर्ने यो तामाङ्ग र मगर लगायत सम्पूर्ण हामी जनजाती भन्नेहरु एक पृथक जाति हो विश्व भरिनै त्यसैले त उनीहरुको आ-आफ्नै मौलिकता छ आम धार्मिक सम्प्रदायहरुको भन्दा जस्तै हिन्दु, मुस्लिम, ईसाई, आदि जसको संस्कार, संस्कृति, परम्परा, कर्मकाण्ड सबै आ-आफ्नो धर्मले निर्देशित र नियन्त्रित भएको हुन्छ | जनजाती भन्नेको कुनै त्यस्तो संगठित धर्म छैन मात्र उनीहरुलाई पछि उनीहरुको भूमिमा बाहिरबाट आएका शासक शोषक जो बने उनीहरुले लादेर हिन्दु, मुस्लिम, ईसाई, आदि बनाई दिएको हो | नत्र उनीहरुको आफ्नो मौलिक धर्म, संस्कार, संस्कृति, र परम्परा भनेको प्रकृति र पितृ पुजक हुन् र सोहि अनुसार उनीहरुको रहन सहन गर्दै आएका जाति हुन् यो जनजाती भन्नेहरु विश्व भरि नै यस्तै छ उनीहरुको आफ्नो संस्कार, संस्कृति, परमपरा र धर्म |

यदि तपाईले प्रो. डोर बहादुर विष्टको "भाग्यबाद र विकास आधुनिक नेपाल निर्माणको लागि संघर्ष" भन्ने पुस्तक जुन प्रकासित गरेका थिए सन् १९९० मा सो अध्धयन गर्नु भयो भने बुझ्नु हुन्छ कि यो छेत्री भन्ने जात पहिले थिएन मात्र खस भन्ने थियो सुदुर र मध्यम पश्चिम नेपालमा जसको आफ्नै पृथक मौलिकता थियो १४ औ शताब्दी ताका र उनीहरुलाई जनजाती नै भन्थे उनीहरु मोस्टो र बुद्ध धर्म मान्ने गर्थे | तर पछि पी.एन. शाहले एकीकरण गरेपछि उनीहरुलाई हिन्दुवाद बनाएको मनुबादको सिद्धान्त अनुसार भनेर प्रष्ट उल्लेख गर्नु भएको छ सप्रमाण | सोहि भएको हो नेवार र मगर जातिमा पनि भन्ने कुरा समेत उल्लेख गर्नु भएको छ उहाँको पुस्तकमा |

नेपालको पहिलो कानून "मानव न्याय शास्त्र" जुन तयार गरेका थिए १४ औ शब्ताब्दिमा हिन्दुस्तानको ५ जना ब्राह्मणहरुको सहयोगमा राजा जय स्थिति मल्लको पालामा तथा दोस्रो कानून "मुलुकी ऐन" जुन तयार परेका थिए सन् १८५४ मा मनुबाद नीति अनुसार त्यसले नै हो नेपालको आम जन समुदायहरुलाई सानो ठुलो, छुत अछुत, मतवाली, मासिने, आदिको आधारमा ५ जातजातिमा विभाजन गरेको थियो | सो मनुबादको पुस्तकमा बाहुन र क्षत्रीय सम्बन्ध कस्तो हुन्छ भनेर यसरी उल्लेख गरेका छन्,

"दश वर्षको ब्राह्मण र सय वर्षको क्षत्रीय यी दुईलाई पिता-पुत्र सम्झिनु पर्छ, दुई जनामा ब्राह्मण चाही पिता समान हो |"

- मनुस्मृति २/१३५

त्यसैले तपाईको जुन जिज्ञासा र सुझाव छ त्यो मेरो आफ्नो आधिकारिक क्षेत्र भन्दा बाहिरको हो |

यदि मगर र नेवारहरु आफुलाई जनजाती भन्ने गर्छन भने उनीहरु धार्मिक हिसाबले गैर हिन्दु हुन भनेर उल्लेख गरेका छन् जनजाती महासंघको आफ्नो आधिकारिक वेबपेजमा समेत एक पटक पद्नु होस | 

तर उनीहरु मात्र नभएर हामी सबै हिन्दु हुन सक्छौ, हिन्दु शब्दको उत्पतिको हिसाबले जुन दिएको थियो ९ औ शताब्दीमा मुस्लिमहरुले जो हिन्दुकुस क्षेत्र पारि बस्ने मानिसहरु सबै नै हिन्दु हुन् भनेर | त्यस कारण पनि हिन्दुस्तानमा रहने सम्पूर्ण मानिसहरु आफुलाई हिन्दु भन्ने गर्छन भनेर हिन्दुस्तानको हिन्दुवादीहरुको संस्था राष्ट्र स्वयं सेवकको अध्यक्ष मोहन भगत जी ले भन्नु भएको छ नि हौ |

आशा छ मैले यहाँको सम्पूर्ण जिज्ञासाको उतर दिए होला भनेर |

धन्यवाद |

लक्ष्मी तामांग

Discussion about Vedism and Buddhism

I love knowing the truth, fact and reality rather than assertion and claim based on scripture knowledge and information that have been swallowed by mass and majority of human beings across the globe from early childhood socialisation process that has made them indoctrinated, cultured humanoid and dogmatic who cannot think and give logic behind scripture thoughts, ideas and knowledge read, heard and swallowed by them. 

I had a wonderful discussion with one Magar man from Singapore who happened to be very much knowledgeable about Veda who is a citizen of India. 

He thinks that Vedism was great than Buddha teaching so I have to give him justification based on fact, truth and reality evidence and logic since he was a logic lover. In our discussion he said:

"Vedic wisdom is totally different than current Hinduism Vedanta brahmanism whatever! And does not believe in idol worship. Yes Veda believes that source of manifested nature is shunya that is Mool Prakriti or primordial nature Which is beyond the observation of physical senses! But a universal conscious force which has infinite power and knowledge brought it from shunya invisible state to drashya visible state with effort and know how! That universal consciousness is invisible and permeates everything that is visible and also is still invisible. Veda called it Aum and many other names. Budha called it shunya also because of invisible nature. Another reason for shunyawad was because of the blind illogical rituals that corrupt bahuns were preaching in the name of creator God."

I told him that:
I am pretty sure you are not up to the level of in knowledge and understanding about Vedism and Hinduism like a Indian great and renowned personality Swami Vivekananda who said "At the time Buddha was born, India was in need of a great spiritual leader, a prophet. All my life I have been very fond of Buddha. I have more veneration for that character than any other— that boldness, that fearlessness, and that tremendous love! He was born for the good of men. Others may seek God, others may seek truth for themselves; he did not even care to know truth for himself. He sought truth because people were in misery. How to help them, that was his only concern. Throughout his life he never had a thought for himself. Buddha died at a ripe old age. I remember a friend of mine, a great American scientist, who was fond of reading his life. He did not like the death of Buddha, because he was not crucified. What a false idea! For a man to be great he must be murdered! Such ideas never prevailed in India. This great Buddha travelled all over India, denouncing her gods and even the God of the universe, and yet he lived to a good old age. For eighty years he lived, and had converted half the country. Buddha is expressly agnostic about God; but God is everywhere preached in our religion. The Vedas teach God -- both personal and impersonal. God is everywhere preached in the Gita. Hinduism is nothing without God. The Vedas are nothing without Him. That is the only way to salvation. Sannyasins have to repeat the following, several times: I, wishing for Mukti, take refuge in God, who created the world, who breathed out the Vedas. Buddha is said to have denied the Vedas because there is so much Himsa (killing) and other things. Every page of Buddhism is a fight with the Vedas (the ritualistic aspect). But he had no authority to do so."

I further wrote:
Vedism believes in creator like Abrahamic religions do whereas Buddha teaching doesn't believe in such imaginative idol and figure rather Buddha believed in the law of nature, natural phenomenon as scientific world thinks and believes how this universe has formed. Please learn the difference between Buddha teachings and others who believe in creationist "GOD". 

Whatever you said you are right in your own level of present understanding about Veda and Buddha and I am also right in my own present level of understanding and consciousness about the issues. BUT please get in-depth insight regarding the difference between Veda and Buddha teaching. I am not against nor for about Veda or Buddha teaching. I am just sharing what I have understood. It seems that you are mostly one sided with vedic wisdom only.

You have to give valid reason with fact, truth and reality WHY Mahabir who formed Janism and Siddhartha Gautam didn't satisfy with Veda knowledge also WHY so many Brahmin who taught veda didn't satisfy with knowledge that they preached which you can understand once you watch above Zee TV episode made by Singaporean Indian origin men.

Then he said:
Can you rephrase what you said in your previous post as there is too many typos. Budha Mahabir etc never studied Sanskrit and Veda. Because the Brahmins never allowed any one to study! That is why I say bahuns hijacked Vedic wisdom. These great Atmans learned through the scientific methods by their own observation.

I replied to him saying,
it sounds that you have forgotten that almost all Kshatriya used to be a King and Brahmins were teachers of those kings and their family members, Kshatriya. Therefore, as far as I knew from historical fact that Kaundinya was born before the time of Siddhartha to a wealthy brahmin family in a town named in Donavatthu, near Kapilavastu, and was known by his family name. When he was growing up, he mastered the three Vedas at a young age and excelled in the science of physiognomy and he taught all 4 vedas to Siddhartha Gautam Buddha and his other family members at the palace who didn't satisfy him with veda knowledge and later became asceitic and very lately became Buddha student himself.